this is a topic i’ve been heavily involved with because i still consider myself to be someone who prefers using technology at a very beginner friendly level, plus it’s very good when a linux operating system makes you feel right at home when it has a modern desktop environment. this is why i really like gnome, its simplicity and usability is something available for everyone, for beginners and for a lot of other people, but if you had to, say, rearrange xfce or kde for someone who was an elderly person or an absolute beginner so that they wouldn’t have any trouble using linux, how would you do it? (screenshot is my current linux mint desktop, very simple and extremely user friendly!!!)
Block or remove the terminal and judge the disastrous performance on its ability to work after the fact
Pls send me ur wallpaper (I fucking love stolas)
Linux Mint, just ensure the hardware is 100% supported.
Mint and Fedora based distros already do it good
Any more simpler and it would be an atomic distro that focuses mainly on flatpak and chromium
I think linux mint is already there.
I don’t even know how could it be simplified more. It’s really basic.
The only obstacle there is the previous familiarity with other operative systems that could make change bard. But I’m pretty sure that if you put anyone truly novice in tech in front of linux mint and windows 11, they’ll have an easier time on linux mint.
Make it easy to change the font sizes, etc.
I setup an Ubuntu/Gnome laptop for an older person. When they asked me to make everything bigger, it took me like 20 minutes for a half-assed solution.
That’s part of the reason I switched to Debian/Plasma, although I haven’t replicated this experiment yet…
Something that automatically updates. Despite my best efforts my mom still has me update her Mint install.
Pop!_OS has an option to enable automatic updates.
Then I gotta teach my mom to use modern GNOME. That sounds like hell. It’s fine for younger people but for old people who are familiar with Windows it’s a nightmare.
A wallpaper with Stolas incentivizes me for sure, but unlikely for beginners or elderlies, unless they like Stolas also.
yes it does incentivize me but that’s just a proof of concept, well not really it’s just vanilla linux mint which is user friendly lol!!! lol that’s my favorite show btw, but if i had to make the distro usable for older people, i would put a landscape picture as a wallpaper
My 90yo neighbor has run Mint since before I met him 15 years ago
Aurora Linux + KDE
It’s an immutable version of Fedora with flatpack support.
This is actually a good setup for the vast majority of people.
What would be the difference between Fedora Kinoite and this?
It uses Universal Blue, whereas Kinoite uses rpm-ostree.
Aurora has a bit of DE customization, which is arguably more polished.
It also leans heavily on Flatpack/Flathub.
The other difference that I’m aware of is Aurora handles updates automatically by default, whereas Kinoite is a manual process.
To be clear, I haven’t used Kinoite at all. But I have Aurora on a gaming system that I use as a kind of TV gaming console, and I’m setting it up for my elderly parents that get upset when an icon on Windows changes (that’s how tech illiterate they are).
Mint
As someone who used to sell computers to elderly and people who are generally non tech literate, as well as ran computer literacy courses;
ChromeOS + something like flatpak. I don’t think anything else will really work in the current linux world. Holding on hope for Cosmic based DE.
A Distro must have
- Easy AND reliable DE. KDE has been way too buggy and gnome has been way too hard for my parents to use. Old people often have an extremely hard time learning, it needs to replicate what they already know which is either going to be Windows or OSX most likely. Cosmic should be able to do both nicely when ready.
Reliability is so fucking key here I can not understate it. The computer glitching out is entirely unacceptable. They will not be able to do any debugging nor will you likely be on call 24/7 to fix their issues. They also need security so you can’t just “set and forget” either with no updates in a false sense of stability. Older folk copy and paste shit. Permissions and stability is key here. Flatpak has a lot of potential but it’s not there yet.
No real time AV really hurts here.
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Extremely strong app selection with either android or wine app support. Wine is the most preferable. A lot of people are reliant on windows programs for things like tax filing and all sorts of stuff like crochet software and what not. Android apps however can often be good enough and are extremely simple so with a little help, and you will need to help, they can get by with android app support.
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A11y, screenreaders, OSKs, maginifers etc. We need all of it if we want to fit the “generic elderly support”
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Good performance. Elderly people do NOT like updating systems, Their systems will likely be old. And well they are old too. If a system is slower then what they are used to, and generally non responsive, they may think the bloody thing is broken.
cough cough gnome cough cough
I genuinely do not that that any DE let alone distro is an acceptable daily driver for “general people” because general people have such a wide variety of use cases and needs. Some folk need crochet and tax software, some folk need CNC software like stitchfiddle, Some need magnifier glasses and speech to text. and man, this is only the more common of things i’ve seen.
Remeber folk, a PC that does 99% of what people generally need, does not mean that it will fit the needs of 99% of people. Here is hoping to a bright future, but I don’t think it will be a close one.
Even as a (tech literate) teacher who wants to employ Linux, the lack of compatibility (using wine) with a lot of enterprise type programs and the general hodgepodge that Libre Office is, and the memory leak mess that Only Office is, I just can’t stick to Linux for long. I end up using tiny10 to use a reliable unbloated windows that can run my office 2016 and enterprise apps. Microsoft is just so entrenched and heavily serviced by thousands of people that it’s a slow climb for Linux distros to get anywhere.
The idea of elderly people using windows only programs on Linux using the compatibility layer just seems liable to multiple potential failures.
No real time AV really hurts here.
Nowadays, simply having a browser with ublockOrigin is enough to have them avoid nearly all of those dangers. Also set the browser to always block notifications, I’ve had 3 different family members asking me to remove a virus, which was just Chrome notifications from sketchy sites showing up nonstop on windows.
I also see a lot of people that come in to have their PC’s fixed because of “viruses” that I am able to make go away by just turning off browser notifications. Which I also just install uBO or uBO Lite on almost 100% of browsers on PCs I work on (even if not related to the task at hand). Also I disable lots of the notifications for browsers and other programs in the Windows 10 and 11 notification settings.
Though I have been seeing an uptick of fucked up malware browser extensions that set themselves as “Your organization” policies that are getting harder to remove. In most of those cases I have found that they replace the shortcuts for the browsers to first launch shit from a self-reinstalling location in the root of C drive and/or in AppData. Shit is very frustrating. Mac OS also has some motherfuckers of hijackers that are even worse to get rid of.
Aside from those, the really fucked notifications come from the AV programs that can’t stop themselves from freaking out users. Like even if the user has for some reason paid for every single up-sell because of those notifications. They still show them shit like “You MIGHT be infected.” Though seeing those things have been great for me to point out how the user should actually cancel their subs since at that point it is just scare tactics and adware (which slows shit down).
this is not true. SO many people will download and install whatever. I still get my old customers calling me up for help because they installed some registry cleaners promising to increase their performance by 5x
No, Gnome is a non-starter for being as mouse negative as it is. You are very heavily supposed to use Gnome with keyboard shortcuts and it will only sometimes begrudgingly allow you to use the mouse.
I also really want to kick the app drawer in the head. Why is it two operations deep? Why can’t it be sorted by category like every other Linux app menu?
I would go with Mint Cinnamon, increase font sizes or UI scaling, switch to the Cinnemenu because it offers bigger square icons rather than a tiny list, turn off a lot of its extra features, and put launchers for commonly used applications on the desktop. Configure updates to automatic, and otherwise sand down a few rough edges and I think you’re good to go.
Adopt windows file system with letterer partitions as the root. Plus most people who use computers are used to this paradigm already. Who ever came up with Linux’s file system has poor organization skills
I don’t agree. It’s just because you’re used to drive letters.
I think Linux filesystem is better organised. Everything is (almost) well organised in the right folder.
It might be nicely organized but coming from windows the abbreviations can be downright confusing. For example:
- /bin; recycle bin?
- /etc; other files (etcetera)?
- /home; okay, this is where I can find my own files
- /media; music and pictures? USB drives and CD’s?
- /mnt; no idea but also USBs apparently?
- /root; wait system admin has his own files?
- /sbin; super recycle bin?
- /usr; wait, also where I can find my own files?
Sure, this might be hyperbole and Windows has its own problems, the two different program files folders coming to mind first. But when you come from an OS where system folders are words instead of abbreviations Linux can be really confusing, especially if you are not that tech-savy.
I agree with you and the confusion which may arise with linux file system’s nomenclature if one isn’t used to it. However how many non tech-savy people would venture outside of /home? In my experience, a lot of people I know have no idea of what C: is and usually browse trough the usual documents, music, downloads and so on; in this case a user’s home folder would virtually give them the same experience. If someone wants to go a little bit deeper, at one point has to understand that we are talking about different OSes and cannot expect everything to be 100% the same and should start learning what those differences are.
Most of my family run Linux.
My parents run Linux Mint. It’s simple and looks like Windows. The only thing they need is a browser and LibreOffice.
Some other family members are using ElementaryOS.
The majority of PC users are IT illiterate. They have no idea what the difference between Windows and Linux is or the difference between Chrome and Firefox is.
“This icon is your browser. You know, where you can access the bank. And this icon lets you write documents”.
There was always issues when family members was running Windows. Haven’t had to fix anything after installing Linux instead. Some doesn’t even know they are using Linux. I just said I updated their PC 😅
I ran eOS for years. Something about it just seems…slow? Or maybe just behind. I found over time I was fighting the operating system just as much as I was Windows. But that may have been my own fault, as it was my first serious long term flirt with Linux
