So all I know that the Linux mascot is a penguin and Arch users meme about using Arch. Jokes aside I’m planning on making to the jump to Linux as I’m planning on getting a tower PC. I recently got a steam deck and that kinda demystified the (unrealistic) expectation I had of Linux was all command line stuff and techno babble. This all very future oriented questions* as I haven’t even picked out hardware (probably gonna go prebuilt since I do not trust me) and there’s also the matter of saving up the money for a new PC.
As for my use case (cus I know some software is wonky on Linux compared to windows) it’s mostly between games running on steam, which most of my games play fine on the steam deck, and essays and note taking for my college classes, which I use libre office and obsidian (with excalidraw to hand write my notes) saved to my proton drive and also sync those documents between my surface laptop and home laptop
My ideal OS would be plug it in, let it do… things… and it’s ready to be a PC to install steam and stuff
But first question, as someone who isn’t tech inclined and tinkering is pretty much just a few VERY basic settings in the settings app on windows, so is there a Linux… idk what to call it, type? OS? Thing??? that runs out of the box without me having to install additional software manually or at least automatic setup wizards because like hardware, I do not trust me with setting it up. As for installing it after I wipe whatever computer I choose I assume I’m gonna have some OS installer on a USB and let it work its magic.
Second question, is there any specific hardware that works easier with Linux, I can’t really think of any examples cus with installers and updaters I just the computer handle it, like updating Nvidia stuff in the GeForce app for all I know it’s genuinely performing dark magic during the automated updates
Anyways I probably have way more questions that I have no idea I had, but to wrap up I’m not super tech inclined since I let automated stuff do its thang on windows (if the computer can manage and install it I’m gonna let it do that) and my pc mostly just plays games and do documents on libre office and obsidian
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I recently made the switch back to Linux, to Pop! OS, and I’ve never had such a smooth experience before. It’s currently using GNOME as its desktop environment, which I find a bit shit in general, but they’ve modified it enough so that it’s user friendly and intuitive. It has an “app store” as well that you can use to check for and run updates, search software etc. If you have a big screen, the window tiling function is awesome. Highly recommend you have a look at it!
If you have time to learn how your distro works: Archlinux. If you just want to easily install a distro and everything just works: Linux Mint.
If you want to really learn Linux, then absolutely Arch is the way to go. But OP is looking for something polished out of the box and probably doesn’t want to know much more than that. Some people just want a box that does the thing - and that’s totally fine.
I say all of this as a diehard Arch user (BTW)
Yeah I’ve peeked into some Linux threads from time to time to see if I can even understand what’s happening (spoiler alert: I could not) and I’ve gotten the impression Arch is great for tinkering and experimenting and tweaking which is great, just not the entry point I want lol
From the post:
But first question, as someone who isn’t tech inclined and tinkering […] that runs out of the box without me having to install additional software manually or at least automatic setup wizards because like hardware
Don’t recommend Arch to users who doesn’t want to tinker please. I know, I use Arch. Arch regularly requires user intervention, you should see them on the news: https://archlinux.org/news/ You can see, 3-4 times a year you have to fiddle with some settings, otherwise you can get an unbootable system.
And that’s how we get “the (unrealistic) expectation I had of Linux was all command line stuff and techno babble.”
There are also “easy” Arch like endeavour or cachy, but yeah, for users like him is Arch based not the best choice
But the required config changes can affect those as well.
Like last week I had to change repositories in
pacman.conf. It also affected endeavour, as it doesn’t have separate repos: https://archlinux.org/news/cleaning-up-old-repositories/This mkinitcpio config change should have effected all Arch based distros: https://archlinux.org/news/mkinitcpio-hook-migration-and-early-microcode/
Yeah I’m kinda looking for a “it just works” since I’m not big on tweaking every little thing and I just really wanna play games and work on my documents
But keep in mind Mint is a non rolling distro, it means you have to upgrade to a newer Version in a periodic time (like win XP to win vista). Rolling release distro (like Arch) doesnt have a Version.
XP to Vista is a wrong comparison, as Vista changed the driver system, and on a lot computers it was impossible to upgrade, as drivers for a lot of stuffs wasn’t updated for Vista. Non rolling upgrades similar to the recent windows big updates: it take some time, changes the wallpaper, but not something very complex…
Bazzite would be a great choice in my opinion. It’s meant for gaming, has drivers preinstalled and is immutable (basically impossible to break). I’d suggest using KDE because it’s Windows-like and is the default for desktop mode on SteamOS.
I second this. I installed bazzite on my basement pc and am very happy with it. As a total linux noob it was easy to use. I use that pc more now than my actual gaming pc, because win 11 is just so annoying and slow. I’d like to add one thing: Don’t use Nvidia graphics, as they don’t play nice with linux. It saves you a lot of time in the future if you build your computer with amd stuff.
Ah nice, yeah I was thinking bazzite since it looks hard to break based on what you’ve all been saying and KDE so I have some vague sense of familiarity between windows and my steam deck
Bit of warning about KDE:
It is very customizable, but as a by product is also really easy to completely fuck up. The first time I used it (eons ago) I ended up removing the task bar and couldn’t figure out how to bring it back or launch programs.
Just spend a bit of time reading up on it and you’ll be fine though.
Good to know
FWIW, if you decide to go with KDE and manage to delete your panel, it’s
- right click on the desktop
- enter edit mode
- add panel
- default panel
😉
I feel it’s important to note for new people that, while an immutable OS is great at keeping you from breaking your system, the way it achieves this can make some things you would want to do more difficult. In Bazzite, installing software, for example, works differently than under a typical distribution.
I’ll give the example of two pieces of software that I use regularly: 1Password and Espanso. It took a fair bit of digging to figure out how to install 1Password in a way that would preserve its tight system integration… and it still doesn’t quite work — copying a password in particular contexts just doesn’t put that password on the clipboard, while it works fine in other contexts. Espanso on the other hand just won’t work under Bazzite best I can tell. I haven’t found a way to install it at all so I’m just doing without. Oh My ZSH was also quite tricky, and I got yelled at in the Bazzite Discord for doing it the wrong way. 😅
Plenty of the software I use works fine and was easy to install: FreeTube, Kdenlive, VLC, Zen Browser… unless you count the fact that the 1Password browser integration just won’t work with Zen Browser, presumably because I haven’t found the exact right combination of Flatpak permissions plus settings that will allow it to.
All this to say, I love Bazzite for gaming and use it every day, but the moment you step outside that world and want your computer to do something a little bit differently, it’s a major headache. In the context of gaming, it’s much closer to “just works” than any other distro I’ve tried.
In Bazzite, installing software, for example, works differently than under a typical distribution.
This is true, but it’s also on the whole a lot more familiar to a non-Linux user (open app store, search, download).
You’re right, but part of the draw of Linux is that you have more control over your OS. An immutable distro makes that a lot harder to get at as compared to non-immutable.
I think a lot of the problem is every tutorial expects Fedora/RedHat/Ubuntu/Debian and it’s easy to figure out which instructions are compatible with your distribution, but there isn’t a good knowledge base for Fedora Atomic or related OS. I have a Bazzite VM. Normally I use Ubuntu and am familiar with RHEL compatible, but am constantly lost with Bazzite, trying to use the wrong instructions.
Pro tip is to install a virtual machine like virtualbox or something on your Windows system. They’re super easy to set up with loads of tutorials on youtube.
From there you can install any number of linux distros (I recommend Mint or Pop!) and try them out without having to commit to real hardware. I would put the VM in fullscreen and pretend it was a real system, and use it as my dedicated machine for as long as possible. You can even install steam to get a feel of the setup process (bear in mind you’ll need to set up stuff for graphics acceleration to play most games but the basic setup should be fine!)
As for setup. Most Linux distros are as easy to set up as Windows or MacOS: USB in, boot, select a few basic options and stick to defaults. Reboot. Install stuff. You don’t even need to deal with drivers (even Nvidia is cared for by most installers) which was nicer than burrowing through NV/AMD’s websites to get their driver installers set up.
At that point you won’t be wondering if youve made the right choice when it comes to your next build, and you can get right down to actually using your PC instead of googling things. Good luck!
I really like fedora out of the box but if you’re used to windows some will recommend Linux mint. In fedora there are a lot of packages installable via the software store as well as downloading app images and RPM files.
So I think I’ll look at mint then considering I have no idea what you mean by RPM files but app images ring a bell when I was getting yuzu set up on my steam deck
Definitely go Linux Mint. Especially if it’s your first time with Linux.
I was gonna try bazzite first any words of wisdom on it?
Yea, make sure you download the correct edition of Bazzite.
Is there multiple versions or something?
Yes, depending on your hardware.
I looked on the bazzite website and I’m assuming as long I select whatever hardware I’m using (or planning to use) I’ll get the correct version
Mint vs fedora is completely irrelevant here. GNOME vs KDE is more important and fedora supports both.
Which packages can be installed is also completely irrelevant since you can use nix and distrobox and flatpaks on all distros. Package availability is no reason to choose one distro over another.
So nothing in that sentence made sense to me lol, mind explaining?
The difference between distros are the package manager and choice of default software and settings.
E.g. Debian has no wifi enabled. Hence, ubuntu (which is like debian) is much easier because it’s user friendly. Ubuntu uses a disliked packaging format, snap, which is not used by mint. That’s why people love mint, becaus it’s as easy as ubuntu and has no snaps. Blablabla
Whenever you want to know some linux thing, read the arch wiki and you’ll know more about it.
Distrobox is like a vm, you spin up a distro within your OS with no overhead and can use arch on debian. Or ubuntu on arch. Or fedora on opensuse, or all at the same time because why not?
I’d try https://fedoraproject.org/atomic-desktops/ or https://vanillaos.org/ and install most apps as flatpaks. Vanilla is like ubuntu but you don’t mess with the underlying system. Atomic fedora is “the same” but with fedora style. Problems arise at the dev level, not the user level. It should be good to go on your system
Distro - System level stuff. A “type” of linux. Mint, Fedora, Arch, Ubuntu etc.
DE (Desktop environment) - Surface level stuff, i.e. how it looks, behaves, and often what default apps you use for basic stuff like text editing. Gnome, KDE, etc.
Distros have a default DE but often provide different versions using others for people who prefer them.
You likely won’t need to interact with any of that other stuff except flatpaks. Just think of it as a form of distributing and running software.
Ah so it’s just how the software works essentially
It’s more like, the distro is the actual “under the hood” OS and the DE is the looks and user interaction.
Ah that makes sense (i think)
Good point. I still use what it came with, gnome, but kde is more windows like
Some distro’s still require you to setup those things yourself and in the terminal.
So bazzite and mint seem to be recurring themes here for my needs of something that works out of the box, do those need any set up or stuff? I don’t really know exactly what I’m asking here :/
On Mint, flatpaks is enabled in the Mint software center.
Sorry but what’s a flat pack? Is that like an installer?
Flatpak (flathub) is a universal app store. You can install pretty much any app from it, but you do need to be careful of what you install, as always.
Usually software centers have it enabled (supported) by default, so that you can install app from flatpak within the center.
There are other options of install source, like the distro’s own installer - you can think of them as another “app store”, one which is more restricted and more secure.
Oh that’s much simpler than I was expecting lol
Agreed here. On CPU side, don’t go with Intel 13th or 14 th gen, mostly due to the manufacturing defects, check gamers nexus on YouTube if you want to catch back up to speed, the new Intel stuff is fine manufacturing wise, terrible performance, check if the prices are good. GPU, NVIDIA usually has kinkier/ more annoying drivers, but if you want to play with AI or anything like that, NVIDIA is still better.
You can just buy a system with Linux preinstalled. My laptop is from System76. I usually build desktops/towers from scratch but they sell those too.
Installing apps has always been easier on Linux then on Windows as Linux has had large free app stores back 30 years. The question is more are the apps you want in the app store. If not things get harder. I like Debian based distros like Ubuntu or Linux Mint as they have large app stores.
You might want to look at distrowatch.com. Mint is currently at the top.
Try Bazzite:
It will give you an experience that’s familiar compared to the Steam Deck, and everything will “just work” out of the box.
It already has Steam installed and is a great desktop for general use.
Bazzite is probably the best recommendation out of everything I’ve seen so far. It is meant to be like the Steam Deck experience on any machine, and if OP is already familiar with that, why not transition easily?
Couple the familiarity along with Bazzite being an immutable distro, OP can just roll back if they break something.
So what does immutable mean?
But I’ve seen it’s similar to the decks desktop mode from some other comments as well so that seems nice
I haven’t really interacted with desktop mode outside setting up emudeck (mostly DS and switch games)
So what does immutable mean?
The easiest explanation is: You can’t screw it up :)
That’s the reason I use it. It means that the system areas are read-only, and as a user you can’t “wreck” anything by mistake.
Ok cool so that’s probably a positive thing in my case since I don’t plan to tweak things and have no idea what I’m doing
Yeah, on immutable distros, you can’t just “delete system32” (rm -rf /* in Linux parlance), it is read-only (changes on restart with updates applied)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TX0f_vyV06k
This video explains it well
While it could be functional as a cursory watch, it doesn’t seem that Michael Horn has done a good job investigating the subject matter. So, no, I actually disagree with it offering a good explanation. Granted, I couldn’t find any video that does this subject any justice; more often than not, they just tend to overgeneralize or oversimplify.
I was just going for a very high level explanation. If you feel like offering a more in depth definition, feel free to do so here.
I was intending to, but it got very unwieldy real fast. I did provide some very basic pointers, but nothing earth-shattering. I suppose this is a decent read with the acknowledgement that the author has primarily read up on Fedora Atomic (and not the other 'immutable distros). Which ain’t bad for our use as Bazzite is derived from Fedora Atomic anyways.
what does immutable mean?
Strictly speaking, ‘immutable’ means unchanging. For Linux distros, this means that (at least some part of) the OS is read-only.
On any distro, you could invoke the
chattr +i path/to/file_or_directorycommand to make a file or directory of your choosing immutable. Thus preventing you or anyone else from changing that until it’s revoked.The so-called ‘immutable’ distros employ this at the OS-level. However, their implementations (and the implications thereof) may vary significantly amongst them, unless they share some ‘heritage’.
Going over the many different implementations and their implications is out of scope for what this comment intends. Especially as the ‘immutable Linux landscape’ is fast moving. Thus, potentially making it outdated the very next landscape-defining change.
Yeah I’ve seen bazzite pop in a few steam deck discussions, some other comments recommend Mint how do they compare/differ
But like I said in another comment I’m not looking to tweak much, if anything at all, so I think it might be a good fit, definitely gonna take a look at that link when I’m off work
Cool I’ve never seen this.
I completely agree, cannot recommend Bazzite enough. Installed it a year ago, first time linux, has been just smooth sailing
Alright good to hear. I was gonna try bazzite first then mint if I couldn’t get it going
is there a Linux… idk what to call it, type? OS? Thing??? that runs out of the box without me having to install additional software manually or at least automatic setup wizards
The word you are looking for is called a distribution, or distro for short.
I’m surprised no one else has mentioned Bazzite, which should be exactly what you’re looking for.
is there any specific hardware that works easier with Linux
An AMD GPU for sure. Nvidia drivers have come a long way, but they don’t generally behave as well out of the box like AMD.
Yeah bazzite seems like a recurring topic here so I think I’ll check it out first since others have all said it’s similar to the steam decks setup (which has been limited to me installing emudeck but seeing familiar stuff might help me
Imo you should get a System76 computer, it comes with a gaming focused Distro and its the most well respected Linux brand (in the US, for EU I would reccomend Tuxedo). Their mini PCs cost $799 and for a decent full sized PC (with a GPU) prepare to pay over $1.5k.
So kinda standard PC prices
Slightly higher but yeah, also you get a premium PC with no RGB and a wooden finish
Ooooooooo that sounds nice
I might just go from Amazon depending on hardware and price but I’m definitely gonna add this to my list
If you go with Amazon you might get a PC that works with Linux but it probrally wont be preinstalled or optimized for Linux
Oh I highly doubt something has Linux which is why I wanna figure out installation and stuff
Keep in mind by purchasing from Linux brands such as System76 you directly support the development of Linux. In addition Amazon is great for finding PC parts but awful for finding a decently priced prebuilt.
Ah good to know, any recommended parts I don’t really keep up with hardware
If you really want a prebuilt one, of course.
It was explicitly specified that no tinkering should be required, also even if you custom build a PC you wont have several advantages of just going with system76. For example the mini PC uses their fork of coreboot and intigrates with Pop_OS, meanwhile on other systems you would need to manually install coreboot (if its even supported) and bios updates are still an absolute mess (even if you dont care about the privacy benefits of coreboot the extremely fast start up speed alone makes it valuable).
Just deleted my windows parition and grew my cachyos one, im never going back after a week with it, I like cachyos/arch since I can use gnome and plasma at the same time easily (i like swapping looks a lot), idk if its as easy with others since they reccomend you rebase for different des like bazzite, aurora, bluefin. cachyos is straightforward with a gui installer, easier and much faster than windows to install and use, I used ventoy so I can keep using my usb for data.
if you liked the design of older style windows (think like windows XP), you could look into Q4OS. I use it for my laptop and it’s Debian based so you will have pretty decent support applications wise and it has a pretty simple UI. I had never heard of it prior to a few months ago but I have had no issues with it.
Being said, I can’t remember if it has UnattendedUpgrades by default, but that program can be configured on any debian based system to allow for automatic updates. It does take a little bit of configuration if it isn’t pre-installed though.
Ah well windows XP is before my time so I think I’ll look at mint and bazzite for now but at least you gave me another name to look into. The more the merrier!
Mint is another good one, I would probably recommend against their Debian Edition(LMDE 6) though, it sounds good but, it’s their newer system so it doesn’t have all the bugs ironed out yet. I struggled with LMDE when I tried it last summer, which granted a lot of time has passed, but I rarely ever have an issue with their standard Linux Mint releases.
Generally, Linuxmint is the go to distro if you want something that holds your hand, but due to your limited needs outside of gaming and already having a Steam deck you should take a look at Bazzite, which is basically the desktop mode of the Steam deck for PCs.
As for hardware, one thing that can be annoying is NVIDIA (drivers), but that shouldn’t be a major problem with these distros as mint has a built in manager that does everything for you and with Bazzite you just need to specify your GPU when downloading and don’t have to do anything.
My recommendation is download the distros you want to try, get Rufus put them on a USB and then play around with them in demo mode, make sure everything works (graphic card, printers) and you like the distro then start the installer. If you don’t like it you can just unplug the USB and reboot without anything persisting.
Super happy with Bazzite as a gaming PC. I think only a power user might find the “immutableness” of it annoying. You can still install OS packages, it’s just highly discouraged. 90% of the time you’d just be running Flatpaks (a mostly self-contained app that is easy to install and remove). I’m using it with an old-ish NVIDIA card and at first it was troublesome but I think it worked itself out after a few updates. AMD has better compatibility from what I understand.
The difference between NVIDIA and AMD/Intel is that Linux has a different way of handling drivers compared to windows (all drivers are part of the Kernel). AMD/Intel respect this. NVIDIA develop there drivers like on windows even though Linux is not designed this way. Also sometimes a new standard is made (eg Wayland) but NVIDIA has little to no support for a long time. Additionally there drivers are proprietary which limits how distros can/want to ship them.
Yeah I was gonna check out bazzite first then Linux mint
Another comment said that mint will wipe the windows install if I “run” it from an external usb so would I just boot windows like normal
Also does bazzite do the same thing cus I’m probably gonna use that first
As for that Rufus tool is the demo mode something I would use on the new pc
If you start the demo mode there will be no changes to disk until you open the installer for both distros. Most distros will boot into the demo mode directly from the USB and then have a shortcut to start installing. Once you have created a bootable USB it will work with any device so you can test the distros out now with your current machined and when you get the new one you can just plug it in there and see if there are any hardware specific issues
Oh nice, I think that makes some sense to me lol
I also recommend Linux Mint. It’s been hands down the best experience of all the Linux distros I’ve tried.
The installation is done with a USB stick. In short, you download the Linux iso image and create a bootable USB stick with a software. In Windows I have always used Rufus for that.
The Linux installer gives you a choise to wipe everything and install Linux. Installing Mint has always been very straight forward.
I can’t comment on hardware since I’ve only used Linux on +5 year old laptops. They seem to work fine.
There most likely will be many new things that can feel confusing in the beginning, but I’m sure you’ll get the hang of it. There also are tons of good tutorials of everything.
Best of luck to your Linux project!
Oh nice, so I just boot windows as normal then “run” the installer from a usb. As for whatever an iso image that makes no sense to me is that just the “program” that the installer is?
A lot of people have recommended bazzite so i might try that first but mint definitely sounds like a good “I have no idea what I’m doing just start working distro”
I touched on this elsewhere, but seeing your comment here… sort of.
iso image is like a .zip it’s a specific type of file… one that opens into a larger image, namely your entire distro. So you could install windows with an iso file. In order to be useful though, you need to get it onto a flash drive, but not just dragging and dropping. Programs like Rufus, mentioned elsewhere, will take that iso of Bazzite and open it onto the flash drive in a way that the computer will be able to read it later and do something with it.
After you have a working flash drive, you do not boot windows like normal and run the installer from a USB. You’ll have to figure out how to tell your laptop (different but similar for each brand of laptop) to boot from the USB. This usually involves having the USB in the drive, restarting your computer and hitting a specific key to tell it not to boot normally to windows, but instead boot from the flash drive.
I haven’t used Windows in a while and I think there’s also a way to restart windows and tell it to boot from USB as you’re exiting. But that’s what you’ll have to figure out for your specific device. That’ll be true no matter what you end up installing.
Thanks for the info, I’ll probably get more information when I’ve actually chosen hardware and do some big brain research of my own
I personally started out with Debian given that a vast majority of distributions are Debian based, typically paired with KDE Plasma 5 for my desktop environment, and learned from there.
Now Debian is really stable but does require command-line configuration quite often so it may feel complicated but if you’re capable of reading & following documentation then you should be all good.
So a lot of people have recommended bazzite so I might start with that and move to mint if that doesn’t work out for me, how does plasma and Debian fit in cus that stuff is ringing a bell. Like plasma being separate than a distro
how does plasma and Debian fit in cus that stuff is ringing a bell.
Distributions like Ubuntu, Kali Linux, Linux Mint are actually based off of Debian however, each distribution provides their own packages and typically have system files in different places, so packages made for Ubuntu may or may not work with Debian and vice-versa.
Like plasma being separate than a distro
KDE Plasma is a Desktop Environment (aka your desktop). When you install a Linux distro on your computer you’ll typically be given an option on which software you want to pre install. You’ll see software like GNOME, KDE Plasma, Xfce, Cinnamon, etc and by doing a little research into them you can pick the environment that suites you best.
GNOME gave me MacOS vibes while KDE is more Windows.
Hope this explains things easily!
Yeah I think makes sense thanks!
Basically Linux mint or bazzite is the system and how it’s organized while plasma is how I’m seeing that system represented and interacting with it in other words?
Basically Linux mint or bazzite is the system and how it’s organized while plasma is how I’m seeing that system represented and interacting with it in other words?
Yup, seems like you got the gist of it!
Obviously once you start reading documents on software you’ll start to understand it all better. Suggest reading into the Docker engine for self-hosting software on your network!
I second the recommendations for Mint. It should work out of the box. You can download the .iso file from their website and use a program called Rufus to write it to a USB stick. You should be able to plug it in, shut down windows, boot from the USB (may have to go into the boot menu in the UEFI), and it will install linux for you. This will be the same process for most linux distributions.
For installing software on Linux, there is an important difference between Windows and Linux; on windows you typically download an installer .exe and use that to install a program. On Linux, each distro has its own “package manager” which functions a lot like an app store on a phone. The package manager will install the program for you and take care of keeping everything updated for you, so if your GPU drivers, steam, or whatever else needs updating, just run an update on the package manager and it will do everything for you. Some will support automatic updates, so you may need to google how to turn that on for any give distribution’s package manager.
In terms of what hardware works better, most folks will tell you to use AMD graphics cards over Nvidia, but that is about it. Nvidia still has proprietary drivers which don’t always play nice with linux, but as an nvidia user myself, the problems seem to be getting fewer and fewer.
