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I only run out of ram (16GB) when I’m playing minecraft with 280 mods
zram to the rescue
The most ram i ever used on my current system is prolly about 6gb. Most of the times its around 2-3gb most of it being system stuff and librefox. I have 16gb if i ever need it for some reason.
I am running 8 gigs on my piece of shit laptop, and i just have to make sure not to open minecraft and the browser at once, otherwise it’s absolutely fine
With only Codium, Firefox, Spotify and Signal I get close to 16GB :(
If you’re using only Electron-based apps, why not use browser tabs for these?
Codium or VScode and Signal are not available as Browser Apps afaik. And for Spotify - I rarely use that - but when I do it’s nice to have the songs downloaded wich only exists in the Proton APP Version.
There’s an online version of VS Code: vscode.dev (not sure if that’s official, though)
Edit: Oh, well… it cannot open and edit local files, making it useless at least for me.
The fact that electron both exists and is one of the most popular cross-platform development frameworks tells you everything you need to know about the current potato’d state of software development.
The underlying issue is that nobody wants to develop using any of the available cross-platform toolkits that you can compile into native binaries without an entire browser attached. You could use Qt or GTK to build a cross-platform application. But if you use Electron, you can just run the same application on the browser AND as a standalone application.
Me? I’m considering developing my next application in Qt out of all things because it does actually have web support via WASM and I want to learn C++ and gain some Qt experience. Good idea? Probably not.
I have developed personalized tools as part of my job and I chose qt to write them in partially because if a company I work for would ever try to commercialize them, they’d have to either buy qt licenses or open source them.
I cheat a bit though because I use qt through python.
It’s like so many programmers never evolve past the “playing around with web dev stuff” days. The fact that JavaScript is one of the most used languages is appalling.
The whole 1+1 = 11 meme made me laugh and then avoid JavaScript whenever possible, but I wonder if many others saw it and thought, “now I’ve gained more experience in JavaScript!”
I will also never understand how JavaScript development has gotten so complicated with seemingly zero benefits. It takes minutes to do a “frontend build” and the output grows larger all of the time. I bumped into some Angular crap that was hundreds of megabytes somehow, and still AJAX fetched the same info 4x on page load because the “MVCC” or whatever it’s called didn’t even buy them the abstraction of using the same values multiple times on one page…
Yeah it’s ridiculous with every small app needing to be packaged with a full DOM and maybe even an http server for all I know and what should have been a few kb ends up being 1000x that or more.
You know, I’ve always loved C and doing my own memory management. I love learning optimization techniques and applying them.
But you know what? Everybody around me keeps saying I’m being silly. They keep telling me I won’t find any jobs like that. They say I should just swallow my juvenile preferences and go with what’s popular, chasing trends for the entire rest of my career.
I don’t think you can blame people for trending away from quality software. Its clearly against the grain.
Back in the very early 2000s my dad went back to college. There he learne c++ but he also leatned that a great programer makes the program work ans keeps it small. Even bavk his teacher was complianing about newer programs taking up more and more ram.
8 GB is fine for basic tasks and it won’t change anytime soon.
4GB even.
16 was enough. A decade ago.
This is currently me with modded Kerbal Space Program and Cities: Skylines lol
Have you even used Linux? 16GB of RAM is enough, even with electron apps
Man i remember. I have 16GB And running windows I would run out of ram so fast. Now on linux, I feel like I am unable to push the usage beyond 8GB in my regular workflow. I also switched to neovim from vscode, Firefox from Chrome and now only when I compile rust does my ram see any usage peaks.
Nah fuck it, let’s just keep putting some more bullshit in our code because we majored in Philosophy and have no idea what complexity analysis or Big O is. The next gen hardware will take care of that for us.
We used to say 4GB is enough. And before that, a couple hundred MB. I’m staying ahead from now on, so I threw in 64GB. That oughtta last me for another 3/4 of a decade. I’m tired of doing the upgrade race for 30 years and want to be set for a while.
Not in my experience. The electron spotify app + electron discord app + games was too much. Replacing electron with dedicated FF instances worked tho.
Even on windows, its hilarious to compare the RAM Discord uses. I caught the native app doing 2+gb, and Firefox beating it by… 100mb? I didnt compare ram usage too hard on my Stram Deck though between Flatpak and Firefox, but I expect firefox to be a bit better with its addons/plugins, like it was on windows
About 6 months ago I upgraded my desktop from 16 to 48 gigs cause there were a few times I felt like I needed a bigger tmpfs.
Anyway, the other day I set up a simulation of this cluster I’m configuring, just kept piling up virtual machines without looking cause I knew I had all the ram I could need for them. Eventually I got curious and checked my usage, I had just only reached 16 gigs.I think basically the only time I use more that the 16 gigs I had is when I fire up my GPU passthrough windows VM that I use for games, which isn’t your typical usage.
I have a browser tab addiction problem, and I often run both LibreWolf and Firefox at the same time (reasons). I run discord all the time, signal, have a VTT going on, a game, YouTube playing… and I look at my RAM usage and wonder why did I buy so much when I can never reach 16 GB.
While I agree electron apps suck and I avoid them… Whatever you guys are running ain’t a typical use case.
I have the same problem tab suspender addons really help with that.
16 MiB is enough depending on what you’re running.
It used to be that 640K oughta be enough for anyone.
lightweight usage
What distro are you using? What apps are open?
What does
free -hsay?[ugjka@ugjka Music.Videos]$ free -h total used free shared buff/cache available Mem: 29Gi 17Gi 1,8Gi 529Mi 11Gi 11Gi Swap: 14Gi 2,0Gi 12GiI was wondering if your tool was displaying cache as usage, but I guess not. Not sure what you have running that’s consuming that much.
I mentioned this in another comment, but I’m currently running a simulation of a whole proxmox cluster with nodes, storage servers, switches and even a windows client machine active. I’m running that all on gnome with Firefox and discord open and this is my usage
$ free -h total used free shared buff/cache available Mem: 46Gi 16Gi 9.1Gi 168Mi 22Gi 30Gi Swap: 3.8Gi 0B 3.8GiOf course discord is inside Firefox, so that helps, but still…
Run this:
ps aux --sort=-%mem
That doesn’t mean anything. If you have tons of free RAM, programs tend to use more than strictly necessary because it speeds things up. That doesn’t mean they won’t run perfectly fine with 8GiB as well.
Yeah I guess I went from 4 to 8 to 16 to 32 for no reason
I think someone needs to update that old “if programming languages were weapons”. JavaScript is a cursed hammer.
Meh, I never need more than 2G usually and that too only when Firefox is running.
The only time I can remember 16 GB not being sufficient for me is when I tried to run an LLM that required a tad more than 11 GB and I had just under 11 GB of memory available due to the other applications that were running.
I guess my usage is relatively lightweight. A browser with a maximum of about 100 open tabs, a terminal, a couple of other applications (some of them electron based) and sometimes a VM that I allocate maybe 4 GB to or something. And the occasional Age of Empires II DE, which even runs fine on my other laptop from 2016 with 16 GB of RAM in it. I still ordered 32 GB so I can play around with local LLMs a bit more.
Yeah, but if you’re interested in running an LLM faster than 1 token per minute, RAM won’t matter. You’ll need as much VRAM as you can get.
Sure, but I’m just playing around with small quantized models on my laptop with integrated graphics and the RAM was insanely cheap. It just interests me what LLMs are capable of that can be run on such hardware. For example, llama 3.2 3B only needs about 3.5 GB of RAM, runs at about 10 tokens per second and while it’s in no way comparable to the LLMs that I use for my day to day tasks, it doesn’t seem to be that bad. Llama 3.1 8B runs at about half that speed, which is a bit slow, but still bearable. Anything bigger than that is too slow to be useful, but still interesting to try for comparison.
I’ve got an old desktop with a pretty decent GPU in it with 24 GB of VRAM, but it’s collecting dust. It’s noisy and power hungry (older generation dual socket Intel Xeon) and still incapable of running large LLMs without additional GPUs. Even if it were capable, I wouldn’t want it to be turned on all the time due to the noise and heat in my home office, so I’ve not even tried running anything on it yet.
I hate electron apps. Just make a website asshole, don’t bundle a whole chrome browser! The only one I’ll tolerate is ferdium, because having a message control center is kinda neat.
Also, massive security surfaces.
Any music producer is familiar with 3rd party license managers like ilok that make you use their Shit-ass electron application that gets an update once every few years.
I want normal applications, that run on my computer I have at home!
hank hill jpeg meme.jpg
You don’t comprehend just how easy it is to do GUI programming in Javascript. Like if C++ is a nunchuck and Bash is a cursed hammer and lisp is a shiv then when it comes to GUI programming Javascript is Vector’s control panel from dispicable me.
that’s fine, give me the hammer. I despise this increasingly pervasive online first mentality. I like native applications using native toolkits. They’re installed on my machine for a reason. I don’t want the clusterfuck of HTML, CAS, and JavaScript managing my interfaces; they’re horrible. Just because a monkey eating pop rocks can piss out a Pollock doesn’t mean i wanna buy it. I am absolutely willing to trade some UI/UX niceties for actual fucking applications.
I remember all the windows users saying 16gb of ram is enough
